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I don't like defining everything in terms of power.

Let's imagine a theoretical person whose job is to decide whether his country should go to war. Whenever the politicians want to send their army around, they need to go to him for approval. He says "yes" or "no", and that's it. He never appears in public, so that he can't be influenced by public opinion.

Now, the reason for this admittedly silly scenario is that if life is about power, this job ought to seem glamorous. Deciding whether a war will be fought is power over the course of history! But it seems like an awful job, because there's no opportunity in it except that one choice.

I suggest an alternate perspective: the appeal of power is that it leads to many opportunities. I think we naturally want to make ourselves useful. That's not all there is to life, but that's a lot of it. When you see people moving ever-upward on the ladder of power, the reason they do it is because they can find more use for themselves on the higher rung.

This is why simulation strategy games are so addictive, even though we understand they have no effect on the real world. The more complex the system the more opportunities to use it. So games like Civilization or The Sims become more engaging than real life, because they offer more frequent opportunities to apply oneself.

Another fine piece of prose there ...

But sorry, I don't quite follow your closing remarks Chris ... "Perhaps, the most fruitful way to face the idea of the will to power is not to attempt to show how the world is not this interplay of power relationships, although many such alternative views are certainly attainable, but rather to consider how we should like our will to power to be expended: to ask, as Arendt dares us to do, “what are we fighting for?” "

er, given it is not difficult to develop hypotheses that persuasively counter Nietzsche's worldview, then the need "to consider how we should like our will to power to be expended" is rendered redundant surely. For whilst Nietzsche's doctrines are legitimate as a point-of-view, they're only one facet of a set of far more sophisticated perceptions. But frankly, by themselves - they're a load of simplistic stuff 'n' nonsense really!

Still, an interesting post!

OK then,
All The Best!

Yes, I have to say that unless we play enormously untraditional language games with the words 'will' and 'power', I don't see this theory as a particularly good description of how everything works.

I mean, if Nietzche's power is similar to force, force is necessarily causal, but chance is non-causal and highly influential from most people's perspective. So where does it fit?

Mory: I like your perspective here, although I find it quite hard to see politicians as solely motivated by a desire to be "more useful". :)

obd: I suppose my point here is that I don't think feel that Nietzsche's perspective here is invalid, and so I am proposing a response to it that pushes into a more positive space.

I'm not sure I'd call Nietzsche's view "simplistic" though - it can be read simplistically, but it's clear from Nietzsche's writing that he has quite a complex view of the world. And indeed, that's what fuels continued discussions about his philosophy even today! :)

zenBen: the question of how chance fits into Nietzsche's concept of "will to power" seems to me to shift his idea away from a way of thinking about morality or behaviour and into the space of attempts to model the world (science, if you like, although this attempt predates what we now call science). The "will to power" is not intended as a scientific idea but rather as a foundation against which a different morality could (potentially) be developed.

One might just as well ask: "how does chance fit into morality"? :)

---

No Peter? Guess he's busy.

Thanks for the comments!

He's mad busy on www.uhsm.nhs.uk and hopes to comment over the weekend.

Man, Chris, this piece isn't controversial enough! You're not going to get any flame wars like this :s

It makes sense that power belongs to a group. After all, humans are very weak by themselves. If two people with the same ideals join forces they will be stronger than if they were alone. You seem to suggest that Arendt equating power with the group gives a twist to the Will to Power, but did Nietzsche really see power as a property of the individual? Your explanation in the first paragraph suggests otherwise:

"It was Nietzsche's view that everything that happens in our lives, and in the world around us, can be interpreted in terms of power relationships that take place amongst configurations of forces where the basic tendency is to expand, expend or transform."

This doesn't make it sound like Nietzsche was talking only about an individual's power! Even if we can understand a group of people acting in concert as a single entity, that still doesn't mean it's a single person.

Anyway, it seems you don't necessarily disagree with the will to power, only that you're not too keen on how it might simplify potentially more complicated situations?

Sirc: I don't think I was fishing for controversy with this piece. :)

You're absolutely right - Nietzsche doesn't see *power* as an individual property, and he talks in terms of people whose will to power align working together... But I think by conceptualising as *will* to power, the tendency is to fall into egoistic spaces, while Arendt's take on power feels more aligned with the potential for social justice. (This may be a consequence of other perspectives in Nietzsche's work - a crosstalk effect, if you will).

I have no problem with the "will to power" perspective, but it's one of those lenses that for me doesn't click and crackle with the potential for great things, but rather seems just another available point of view. I think some people wield views of this kind to support rather self-defeating political positions, which is why I prefer Arendt's spin on it.

I suppose I use something like this perspective when I think of the business world as being essentially a feudal system, but this is just one of the ways I look it... I would never assign priority to this one perspective, if you see what I mean.

Anyway, I have now discharged my duty to bring up this topic in its own post. ;)

Cheers!

IMHO, the whole point of the induvidualistic perspective of "the will to power" is an argument in a circle - which many great arguments are. In a sense they are complete:

An induvidual has to define for him/herself what "will to power" is, for him/herself, and others. That in itself is what a will to power can only be.

The questions "What is will? What is power?" can only result in some type of contradiction in one sense or another...unless the induvidual defines them in terms of the greatest good for him/herself. That will be the greatest good for for his/her community; not becuase of the obviously resulting conflict, but becuase no community can properly and happily function when only one, or a few will in a such way.

Jordan H.Z.: thanks for your comment; for some reason circular arguments are often more compelling because they feel "grounded" - it's not always apparent that being grounded circularly is not actually a very secure footing! :)

I'm not sure that one is forced to take a "greatest good" reading here, though, although certainly moving into this space makes it easier for a community to function. But Nietzsche was largely against such reasoning, but not obviously against community... on the other hand, you are only talking about the "greatest good" from an individual, personal, perspective - and that, frankly, could mean anything. :)

Best wishes!

"on the other hand, you are only talking about the "greatest good" from an individual, personal, perspective - and that, frankly, could mean anything. :)"

That's my point Chris - it can and should be something that is hard to define in a sure 'popular' sense. One person's 'will' or 'power' would not be another's. It is not extremely hard to understand the 'elitism' of the "Will to Power" if a person understood from a moral sense we are all elitists and non-elitists. The poor man often does not like to understand the rich, vice versa.

It is for the above reason(s) that "The Will to Power" is often thought of as the first major existential peice of work. :)

Thoughts? Comments? Thanks!

Jordan: thanks for expanding your point here; I understand what you are saying.

And yes, Nietzsche's philosophy was certainly fundamental to existentialism (although "the Will to Power" is merely a Nietzschean *concept*, not an actual work) - but Kierkegaard was dabbling in this considerably earlier than Nietzsche. A letter in 1835 discusses these themes, while Nietzsche has no major philosophical works prior to 1870. :p

Best wishes!

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